I've been relatively silent until now...

[Shorinji]

...But I can maintain this silence no longer. Someone has to say something about all of this. I have a habit of making things more complicated when I speak unnecessarily, so I decided to wait and see how things would go without my intervention. I regret that decision now.

Too many people have left the guild for various reasons, and it needs to stop. Seriously. Several of you have said that the guild is falling apart, and that it lacks unity. Please explain to me your logic: How exactly does you leaving us help the situation? How does turning your backs to us bring unity back? The simple answer is: It doesn't.

fellowmister said:

I, for one, took pride in that we always did what we could to keep our pirates in pirates. Since this is no longer the case, I dont have the same sense of pride. We've fallen victim to what others think of us, rather than what we think of ourselves.

Please don't take offense to this, but... That is a very ironic statement, Rob. If that is what you had pride in, then you should be the last person to leave, regardless of reason. If you really want to see the condition of the guild improve, then you would stay with us and help us return Pirates to what it was. By leaving us, the situation only becomes more complicated.

jingyang said:

You guys make me feel down. Considering if i should quit maple =/ .

Lisa, what would it solve if you did? I've already quit Maple once before, so believe me when I say that it will accomplish nothing. I thought I had sufficient reason to leave this game behind me, but the fact that I'm here now proves that quitting won't help anything. I already had to learn this the hard way, please don't make the same mistake as me.

---

I can't quote the things said in-game for obvious reasons, but I'd still like to touch on a few of these things.

To Alexa: You're pissed at Joel, and I understand that. I'm not asking you to forgive him right away, or even at all, that is entirely your decision. But answer one thing for me, if you ever see this post: Why is it that one person was all it took for you to abandon the rest of us?

To our friends whom are former-hackers: Please do not take anything that was said personally. I, at least, still consider you guys as friends, but I want you all to understand something. This guild used to have a zero-tolerance for ex-hackers and current hackers alike. For us to suddenly realize that some of our friends used to hack, and are thusly using illegitimate characters, is a very confusing topic for us all. On one hand, we have what our guild used to stand for (no hackers whatsoever), versus who our friends are in the other hand. We didn't want to see you guys leave us, and still don't. But at the same time, we cannot support the use of illegit characters. To put it simply: We don't know what to do here.

Even I'm not certain how we should handle this matter. We all have many, many, reasons for disliking anyone who has hacked, I have a rather large list myself. I've played several MMO's and the result is typically the same for them all: Hackers really do screw up the game's economy. Badly. The negative effect that hacking has on a game's community is the reason why hacking is frowned upon so strongly, and the reason why this matter is so confusing to us.

To Everyone else who recently left: I didn't get a very clear answer of why you guys chose to leave, and I decided not to pursue such an answer. For this reason, I'm really not sure what to say to you guys, but please, do continue reading this post.

---

A long time ago, me and Mazz had a giant conflict that put this guild into a huge amount of chaos. He was honestly the only person in this guild who had ever pissed me off to the degree of feeling compelled to either remove him, or myself, from the guild. Either choice would have been a huge mistake, and in my anger I did chose one of those options. I won't go into all the details, but the summary is: my actions caused the guild a lot of trouble once. This is something that I never want to see again.

Yes, the guild is going through some problems, but I have news for you all: Nothing in this world, not a guild on an MMO, and not anything in real life, is ever perfect. If you leave a guild every time some drama settles in, then get used to being guild-less. Conflicts are going to happen, it is inevitable. As long as two or more people interact with each other, they will eventually have a difference of opinion. We do not have the power to magically stop these conflicts from happening. However, we do have the power to change how we allow these conflicts to affect us.

Please listen to what I am about to say. If you truly care about this guild, then you will stay with us. If this guild is to ever be successful in any way, shape, or form, all of our members must understand that we have to work through our problems together. As a team. As a guild.

"I'll just leave until you guys sort it out yourselves." Mark my words: If everyone shares that opinion, this guild will die. A problem cannot be fixed if everyone turns their backs to it. If we don't stand up together, for the good of this guild, then who will?

It is true, the issues we are going through right now has everyone on edge, and these problems will take time to fix. But I need each of you to understand that leaving us will not solve anything. If you take any pride at all in being a Pirate, then stay with us and help us work through this together.

I honestly don't know how we can make everything right again, but I do know one thing: I'm willing to do whatever I must for this guild. What about the rest of you?

[chuu]

I left because of all of these new level 30-40's started joining, and there was 4-5 people I know well and were my friends left out of 30. There grammar was so horrible. D: 'h3y j1ng do u w@nna gpq plz?'

[Dawn]

*blink blink*

[fellowmister]

Heres the deal, you have contradicted yourself now that I have read through this. You argued with me in game on whether or not we had stopped holding to the pure legitimacy clause. In your own post here, you have used the words 'used to' in reference to that clause. If I knew how to do the little quote thing, I would, but you can read your own post just fine. Second, I stated in my own thread that I left because we were no longer holding to friendship, and Jing himself was not listening and instead had himself become the flamer, flaming Roy. Krissy was involved to. You, Ty, can hate me all you like because I am calling someone who you liked at one point, out on something that she has done. The facts are solid, Jing has flopped back and forth like a fish on what he stands for. If you read the thread on the SW forums, then you know this, and you know that in them he said he refused to kick Sandra because she was his friend. Sorry, Jing, but that wasnt good leadership. I still like you, and am completely aware of the stress you were under from both sides, but when I talked to you to get you to come back yourself, I spoke of us taking pride in friendship since that is what we had left. When I got back two hours later, you and Krissy were gutting Roy. Yes he lied, but at one point you knew Sandra was a hacker too, and that didnt dismember a friendship at that time. Roy is still our friend, I dont know about Sandra.. I wasnt there for what happened today. Roy was afraid of letting it be known, because he was afraid people would do just what they have done. Judge him for his past and not for who he is now. You can all try to argue this all you like and Ill stand firm all day long, because I am not the one is being close minded. I have an open mind, enough to accept that we made a mistake. If you wont admit that we have flopped on our stances, then you are the ones with the closed-minds.

[lawlwtf]

I will stick with this guild. We are probably the best known guild in Windia. We can succeed in getting the whole guild more unified. Maybe by doing more GPQs and working together even at different levels we can become better friends with eachother and have a great time. We should have a day of the week where 2 or three guild parties are made to go on GPQs together. It would be a great start in building up a better friendship with eachother so we stick together for as long as possible.

[Darkning]

Blow-the-fish-out-of-the-water post, Ty. I totally agree and couldn't have said it better myself.

Now, if I ever wind up leaving the guild it wouldn't be because of these reasons, but simply being ready to move on. But I don't expect that happening soon! ^_^

[Shorinji]

fellowmister said:

Heres the deal, you have contradicted yourself now that I have read through this. You argued with me in game on whether or not we had stopped holding to the pure legitimacy clause. In your own post here, you have used the words 'used to' in reference to that clause. If I knew how to do the little quote thing, I would, but you can read your own post just fine. Second, I stated in my own thread that I left because we were no longer holding to friendship, and Jing himself was not listening and instead had himself become the flamer, flaming Roy. Krissy was involved to. You, Ty, can hate me all you like because I am calling someone who you liked at one point, out on something that she has done. The facts are solid, Jing has flopped back and forth like a fish on what he stands for. If you read the thread on the SW forums, then you know this, and you know that in them he said he refused to kick Sandra because she was his friend. Sorry, Jing, but that wasnt good leadership. I still like you, and am completely aware of the stress you were under from both sides, but when I talked to you to get you to come back yourself, I spoke of us taking pride in friendship since that is what we had left. When I got back two hours later, you and Krissy were gutting Roy. Yes he lied, but at one point you knew Sandra was a hacker too, and that didnt dismember a friendship at that time. Roy is still our friend, I dont know about Sandra.. I wasnt there for what happened today. Roy was afraid of letting it be known, because he was afraid people would do just what they have done. Judge him for his past and not for who he is now. You can all try to argue this all you like and Ill stand firm all day long, because I am not the one is being close minded. I have an open mind, enough to accept that we made a mistake. If you wont admit that we have flopped on our stances, then you are the ones with the closed-minds.

Rob, I'm no longer interested in saying this politely, so I'll be blunt. I do not give a rat's you-know-what as far as what your reason for leaving was. You left, which was the cause of this post. I do not care if you feel the guild has swapped its stance on things. This is why I said you were closed-minded, you completely overlooked the only thing I wanted to make clear to you. Since you refused to listen to what my REAL argument was, I decided to humor you with the debate we had last night. Quoting myself somewhere in the middle of it: "If you still can't see what I'm actually trying to debate with you on, then we have nothing to discuss. We're done here." I don't care what your justification was, all of it is a moot point to me. Since the entire thing has clearly gone over your head, I'll say it once more: I really don't care what you try to say to justify leaving. The fact is, if you would leave during a time of crisis, you are not that loyal. That is my only point. I said this at least 50 times last night, and will say it once more: If you want something to change, you cannot turn your back to it. You called it "stepping down", but I call it "running away". Reply again if you wish, it doesn't matter to me. If you still don't understand this, then we really do have nothing further to discuss.

If you want to leave, rather than try to make an effort to change anything, rather than make an effort to stick together, then feel free to do so. Because that shows where a person's true loyalty lies.

---

Edit: After re-reading your post, I felt the need to add this. If you think this has anything to do with you challenging Krissy, then you really are blind. This has nothing to do with how I feel about anyone, nor does it have anything to do with how I feel about the hacker situation. In addition, I do not hate you now, nor have I ever hated you. I simply disagree with you, there is a huge difference. You have your opinion, and I have my own. Nothing you say will change my opinion on the matter, but you need to understand how little that actually has to do with this topic.

Stay and actually try to change things, or leave and run away from it all. It's your call. If you're that intent on arguing with me, maybe you should take that up with Jing, and not me. Like I said, I care about people leaving during a crisis, not their reasons for it. The loyal don't leave just because things aren't going their way.

[fellowmister]

I took things too far when I did call you an imbecile, you have my apologies for that. I have been sick lately and a lot more besides being on my mind has put me on a short fuse. That was wrong of me, and I take it back, if you'll let me. and I completely admit that I am not entirely loyal to Pirates. I am entirely loyal to Jessi, and am completely aware that I didnt do anything to fix the situation other than talk to Jing, which really wasnt much.. he would have come back on his own.

I am very honest on where I stand, and Im willing to accept having differing opinions. I dont really care for more turmoil between us.

[JingYang]

I was just sad at that point but you're right anyways. Its just so that i feel so ignored sometimes, some people feel the same. And one of the reason that people leave the guild is because of that. I wouldnt even make any difference in the guild.
But I will stay ^_^ unless you dont want me to.

[Tea-nahh. :] (xKirara)]

I agree with Lisa.
The guild revolves around certain people, and other than that a lot of of new people or quiet people are usually ignored.
Like, if someone random logged in, one person might say hi, but say Jing logged in, the whole guild goes crazy with hi's. That could probably be a reason too.
OH OH, but other than that, your post has.. touched me. :]

[chuu]

I agree with Lisa.
The guild revolves around certain people, and other than that a lot of of new people or quiet people are usually ignored.
Like, if someone random logged in, one person might say hi, but say Jing logged in, the whole guild goes crazy with hi's. That could probably be a reason too.
OH OH, but other than that, your post has.. touched me. :]


Not really, when it was the old Pirates they would like. sleeper anyone who logged in.

WingedKojiyu: Chuuuuuuuuuuuu
Something Bao I forgot (Sorry Bao ._.): CHUU!
PirateJing: Hello Chuu.
BlackxCoffin.. I think thats it. o.o: hi
Menye: CHUUUU!
SBCleric: Chuu!
Shorinji: Hello
David: Hi
Beth: Hi

[Pirate Jing]

chuu said:

Not really, when it was the old Pirates they would like. sleeper anyone who logged in.

WingedKojiyu: Chuuuuuuuuuuuu
Something Bao I forgot (Sorry Bao ._.): CHUU!
PirateJing: Hello Chuu.
BlackxCoffin.. I think thats it. o.o: hi
Menye: CHUUUU!
SBCleric: Chuu!
Shorinji: Hello
David: Hi
Beth: Hi

BlackXCoffin and WingedKojiyu are the same people.. And that was just you.

[lf]

Umm. I probably shouldn't even post here anymore, but. I've excuses to make. <_<
For most of the people here, this has nothing to do with you, but it'd provide something of an explanation for my actions earlier to the people I knew before.

I found the reason why I kept leaving Pirates before. It's 'cause guilds are not for me. I love Transcend, but I still want to leave now, just as I loved Pirates, but left anyway. I'm just unable to stay in a guild for very long before I feel depressed until I leave the guild (guild-hopper syndrome? =P). I had other reasons before, but I think it's ultimately this that made me see things in such a way that made those reasons seem like a big problem. Not even that there's another guild that caught my eye, but being in a guild reminds me of being in school. Groups of people I'm constantly trying to get the approval of, but never succeeding to.

All in all, I'd like to apologize for my actions earlier, and if there's anything I can help with, I'll gladly lend a hand.

[Darkning]

fellowmister said:

I took things too far when I did call you an imbecile, you have my apologies for that. I have been sick lately and a lot more besides being on my mind has put me on a short fuse. That was wrong of me, and I take it back, if you'll let me. and I completely admit that I am not entirely loyal to Pirates. I am entirely loyal to Jessi, and am completely aware that I didnt do anything to fix the situation other than talk to Jing, which really wasnt much.. he would have come back on his own.

I am very honest on where I stand, and Im willing to accept having differing opinions. I dont really care for more turmoil between us.

See guys, this is the kind of humility and understanding that the rest of Windia and MapleStory as a whole needs. If only everybody had this attitude about things they may have been wrong about(not trying to rub it in your face, Rob , MS would have such a more enjoyable community.

[fishlips]

admin said:

fellowmister said:

I took things too far when I did call you an imbecile, you have my apologies for that. I have been sick lately and a lot more besides being on my mind has put me on a short fuse. That was wrong of me, and I take it back, if you'll let me. and I completely admit that I am not entirely loyal to Pirates. I am entirely loyal to Jessi, and am completely aware that I didnt do anything to fix the situation other than talk to Jing, which really wasnt much.. he would have come back on his own.

I am very honest on where I stand, and Im willing to accept having differing opinions. I dont really care for more turmoil between us.

See guys, this is the kind of humility and understanding that the rest of Windia and MapleStory as a whole needs. If only everybody had this attitude about things they may have been wrong about(not trying to rub it in your face, Rob , MS would have such a more enjoyable community.

Problem is, most of the kids that are playing in MS, thinks it's "cool" to act like jerks and generally being stupid. That won't changed, that is the nature of our race.